what's been the interplay between our civil rights movement and his struggle? >> well, the leadership, the vision, the commitment, the dedication, the inspiration of this one man meant everything to the american civil rights movement. i remember it as a young student in nashville in 1962 and '63 and '64. we said, if nelson mandela can do it, we can do it. we identify with the struggle and when i met him for the first time. he said to me, john lewis, i know all about you. i follow you, you inspired us. and i said, no, mr. mandela, you inspired us. so that was just unbelievable relationship between what was happening in america and what would happen in south africa. we would say from time to time, the struggle in birmingham, the struggle in selma is inseparable from the struggle in sharpville. >> one of the reasons i wanted to talk to you today, congressman, was reading about and thinking about and trying to understand the importance of those decisions that was made by mandela and other anc leaders and other antiapartheid leaders after sharpville, when they decid